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Is it crazy to buy an Intel Mac Pro (2019) in 2022/2023? | MacRumors Forums

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MP 7,1 Is it crazy to buy an Intel Mac Pro (2019) in 2022/2023?

Canubis

macrumors 6502

Original poster

Oct 22, 2008 Vienna, Austria
My main reasoning behind this: I'd love to have one last really powerful Mac, that can still run Windows through Bootcamp natively. Usage would be probably 50/50 – and I really like the idea of having 1 nice looking machine doing both instead of 2 boxes standing around (one being an ugly PC tower…).

From what I know so far, there is no way and no way in near sight to run Windows natively on any Macs with AS chips. This may change in future (years), but for the time being it's a disappointing situation.

I also like the idea of being able to upgrade the Mac Pro 2019 over coming years (been using a 2009 Mac Pro this way for 10+ years), though being aware full macOS support will vanish probably in the next 3-5y, freezing the machine with the then last macOS version to still support Intel. This would be OK for me, hoping the Windows support will hopefully(?) outlast the macOS support. So worstcase I could probably still upgrade it with new GPUs in 3+ years and run it mostly under Windows with that setup then...

The only part being a real con for me is the hardware not being updated (mostly CPUs) in ~3 years. I know there were rumors of a speedbump update with latest Intel chips being references in some Xcode beta last year – but this update obviously never manifested. And with every rumor of an AS Mac Pro coming soon I find it more and more unlikely we will ever see such an Intel update still.

Guess I am not really sure what to ask even… but curious if anyone else has similar thoughts or is/was in a similar situation even?

MarkC426

macrumors 68030
May 14, 2008 2,906 1,464 UK
It is not crazy, I am in the same boat.
I cannot come to grips with 'non-upgradeable' Macs, after 10+ years with a cMP.

I am waiting for any 'concrete' info on the ASmp, as to what/if upgrades are available.....
Plus I have software which may not get ported to AS, so will always be running in Rosetta.

profdraper

macrumors regular
Jan 14, 2017 Brisbane, Australia
Guess I am not really sure what to ask even… but curious if anyone else has similar thoughts or is/was in a similar situation even?
My 2019 mac pro is not going anywhere soon & I don't trust Apple about any of their future hype. Has been a very productive machine for film and recording studio & aside from the very silly price (especially for AMD GPUs) has been flawless. BTW, my other 2010 mac pro is also still running flawlessly on Mojave, abiet a little too slow for film work but still does music production as well as it ever did.

sn1p3r845

macrumors regular
Feb 9, 2012 Vancouver, BC
BTW, my other 2010 mac pro is also still running flawlessly on Mojave, abiet a little too slow for film work but still does music production as well as it ever did.
something tells me audio production hasn't taken the same major leaps as video production has in the past 15 years.

majus

Contributor
Mar 25, 2004 Oklahoma City, OK
Same position here too, and I'm not buying anything until they announce the ASi Mac Pro.
Last edited: Friday at 5:49 PM

TECK

macrumors 6502a
Nov 18, 2011
I'm curious if Apple will still sell the Mac Pro 2019 model, once the 2023 model is out. @tsialex explained in a post why Intel is doomed at Apple, for various reasons. I cannot find that post but Alex might link it here.

Canubis

macrumors 6502

Original poster

Oct 22, 2008 Vienna, Austria
Same position here too, and I'm not buying anything until they announce the ASI Mac Pro.
Do you expect full Windows support with something like Boot Camp coming soon to AS Macs? (Apparently it seems more of a licensing issue of Microsoft, which I am not sure will be solved unless a lot of PCs will also switch to ARM CPUs.) Or is Windows support not relevant for you, are you mainly interested in the expandability of a potential AS Mac Pro?

Kimmo

macrumors regular
Jul 30, 2011
Crazy? No.

Wise? I guess that really depends on your situation.

Like others, I'm trying to hold out until I get a look at the ASi Mac Pro, but it gets more challenging by the day.

mattspace

macrumors 68020
Jun 5, 2013 2,138 1,705 Australia
Do you expect full Windows support with something like Boot Camp coming soon to AS Macs? (Apparently it seems more of a licensing issue of Microsoft, which I am not sure will be solved unless a lot of PCs will also switch to ARM CPUs.) Or is Windows support not relevant for you, are you mainly interested in the expandability of a potential AS Mac Pro?
What you can't know, is if the ARM version of Windows will stay compatible with the Apple version of ARM. Microsoft might well decide to tune windows for their own custom ARM solutions, possibly even deliberately lock Windows out of Apple hardware on the assumption that a lack of Windows on Apple hardware harms the viability of Macs more than it harms the viability of Windows.

For example, if you could install the Surface version of Windows on an iPad Pro, that would arguably be a better device than the ARM Surface, OR the iPadOS iPad Pro. I would expect Microsoft to be more likely to enable eGPU function in ARM systems than Apple, which is the huge advantage the Intel (but not ARM) Surface Pro currently has over the iPad Pro.

prefuse07

macrumors 6502
Jan 27, 2020 San Francisco, CA
This whole fiasco of everyone going their own way is a terrible terrible terrible decision (IMO). Just think of all of the legacy software that wont be ported over. It just gets lost in time.

Really stupid move IMO, but I am one that still enjoys playing old games (as an example of legacy software that still runs perfectly under x86 arch).

"United we stand, divided we fall" comes to mind.

I too am waiting to see what the AS Mac Pro will offer, if it will just be another joke like the Mac Studio or if it will truly be something revolutionary, but am equally leaning on the side of just getting a 7,1 and throwing my RX-6800XT in it... We will see

saudor

macrumors 65816
Jul 18, 2011 1,298 1,635
what are the specs of your "ugly" pc tower? Depending on that, you could theoretically run a hackintosh but that's a whole different can of worms many aren't willing to open.

Although it has worked great for me. YMMV. The whole intel OS support going poof in a few years makes a multi thousand dollar purchase today meh (at least for me). Of course, if you use it for a business, it wouldn't be as bad.
Reactions: majus and prefuse07

rpmurray

macrumors 68000
Feb 21, 2017 1,637 3,416 Back End of Beyond
... if it will just be another joke like the Mac Studio or if it will truly be something revolutionary ...
I still get a laugh out of how "modular" the Mac Studio is.

prefuse07

macrumors 6502
Jan 27, 2020 San Francisco, CA
I still get a laugh out of how "modular" the Mac Studio is.
have you seen the youtube videos of people taking it apart to try to upgrade it? hilarious!

blackquartz

macrumors member
Oct 22, 2009
My main reasoning behind this: I'd love to have one last really powerful Mac, that can still run Windows through Bootcamp natively. Usage would be probably 50/50 – and I really like the idea of having 1 nice looking machine doing both instead of 2 boxes standing around (one being an ugly PC tower…).

From what I know so far, there is no way and no way in near sight to run Windows natively on any Macs with AS chips. This may change in future (years), but for the time being it's a disappointing situation.

I also like the idea of being able to upgrade the Mac Pro 2019 over coming years (been using a 2009 Mac Pro this way for 10+ years), though being aware full macOS support will vanish probably in the next 3-5y, freezing the machine with the then last macOS version to still support Intel. This would be OK for me, hoping the Windows support will hopefully(?) outlast the macOS support. So worstcase I could probably still upgrade it with new GPUs in 3+ years and run it mostly under Windows with that setup then...

The only part being a real con for me is the hardware not being updated (mostly CPUs) in ~3 years. I know there were rumors of a speedbump update with latest Intel chips being references in some Xcode beta last year – but this update obviously never manifested. And with every rumor of an AS Mac Pro coming soon I find it more and more unlikely we will ever see such an Intel update still.

Guess I am not really sure what to ask even… but curious if anyone else has similar thoughts or is/was in a similar situation even?
I'd say it's a great time to buy a 7,1 Mac Pro specially if you could snatch one off eBay for a great price or even going for the base model yourself and upgrading from there, AMD 6900xts have never been this cheap and the official xeons processors are also at a great value, Its a strong well made machine that should last years and years to come.

marzer

macrumors 65816
Nov 14, 2009 1,380 Colorado
My main reasoning behind this: I'd love to have one last really powerful Mac, that can still run Windows through Bootcamp natively...Guess I am not really sure what to ask even… but curious if anyone else has similar thoughts or is/was in a similar situation even?
Call me crazy!...I did this last year, bought a well endowed 2020 iMac: i9, 32GB, 2TB, pro 5700XT. I've enjoyed AAA gaming in Boot Camp on my iMacs for the last 16 years, so I traded in my still competent 2017 iMac w/pro 580 just to secure the last version of TOL Boot Camp architecture. And the 5700XT does not disappoint.

In fact, I'm crazy enough I did it again this year. I'm doing a lot of leisure traveling and wanted to take a laptop on the road that mirrored my desktop. So recently I bought a (very steeply discounted) used 2019 MacBook pro from B&H: i9, 32GB, 2TB, 5500M. Been a lot of fun on the road having my games with me on a portable Mac! (never owned a Mac laptop before)

ginamong

macrumors newbie
Nov 3, 2022
was looking to upgrade my old 2017 mbpro, so i bought a new 2019 i9 model with 1tb just a few months ago because a reputable computer store was getting rid of their old stock of unopened boxes. combined with an ebay promo, i got it for around 2200 AUD.

just this month i noticed a bunch of refurbished models on the AU apple site, same specs going for over 3000 AUD, so it seems there is still enough demand for them to be charging that much!

I also need the intel chip to run one particular application for work purposes so i will be sticking with this for the foreseeable future. i loaded bootcamp and it runs battlefield 4 great at native resolution---other than running quite hot, no complaints so far, and i don't think you are crazy to buy one if you need the intel for a particular use scenario.
Reactions: haddy and Canubis

Canubis

macrumors 6502

Original poster

Oct 22, 2008 Vienna, Austria
what are the specs of your "ugly" pc tower? Depending on that, you could theoretically run a hackintosh but that's a whole different can of worms many aren't willing to open.

Although it has worked great for me. YMMV. The whole intel OS support going poof in a few years makes a multi thousand dollar purchase today meh (at least for me). Of course, if you use it for a business, it wouldn't be as bad.
I don't have an "ugly" pc tower yet - this was more hypothetical thinking, like what is the alternative. Sooner or later I'd buy another Mac, which would be AS based then. And to run Windows I'd need another box sitting next to it running Windows.

I just really prefer to have a natively supported machine by Apple for at least another few years and not have to care too much about any details of compatibility. A little tinkering here and there in coming years to further improve the system is OK for me. But hackintosh really is a can of worms I'd rather stay away from, although I've heard some positive things. This is actually one of the very intriguing aspects I see the current Intel Mac Pro, even if outdated, the system would just work as bought for macOS and getting also Windows 10 to run on it should be minimal effort and equally "just works".

TheSufle

macrumors member
Feb 13, 2019
something tells me audio production hasn't taken the same major leaps as video production has in the past 15 years.
it's funny, but more music has been made than films, third-party equipment decides more here

avro707

macrumors 65816
Dec 13, 2010 1,117
I'd say it's a great time to buy a 7,1 Mac Pro specially if you could snatch one off eBay for a great price or even going for the base model yourself and upgrading from there, AMD 6900xts have never been this cheap and the official xeons processors are also at a great value, Its a strong well made machine that should last years and years to come.
You can certainly find 16 core Mac Pros with 96gb ram and dual video cards for USD$1200 on e-bay, but as for whether you'll actually end up with a computer after paying your money, who knows...

The reputable listings are all quite expensive. When I was looking a base model machine in Australia ended up going for AUD$5000 second hand after a bidding war. Another higher spec machine was AUD$13,000 second hand. Too much. It was better to just buy a brand new one. There seems to be demand for these machines so the prices aren't cheap, certainly not cheap in the way one forum member here used to say (ie, nobody wants them, prices falling, etc).
It is not crazy, I am in the same boat.
I cannot come to grips with 'non-upgradeable' Macs, after 10+ years with a cMP.

I am waiting for any 'concrete' info on the ASmp, as to what/if upgrades are available.....
Plus I have software which may not get ported to AS, so will always be running in Rosetta.
I imagine you'll have to upgrade to the 2019 Mac Pro eventually - the 2010-2012 is just far too old these days. The 2019 is also a much better machine for upgrades.


For me any Apple Silicon based machine that cannot run a GPU like a W6800X or similar is out. And it should also be able to run Windows 11. If not, it's no use. That's why the 2019 is great.
Last edited: Saturday at 2:26 PM
Reactions: MarkC426

EugW

macrumors G5
Jun 18, 2017 12,477 9,936
I was checking eBay sales of used high end 2019 Mac Pros a while back, and for the several months prior to when I checked there were NO sales at all in North America. None. Zilch. It seems almost nobody is willing to pay a significant amount for them on the used market, regardless of how reputable the seller is. All the sales that happened were of lower end models. Yes, people were buying upgrade parts, but complete used high end Mac Pro sales in North America appears to have tanked.

Anyhow, the predominant rumour now about the Apple Silicon Mac Pro is that it will get PCIe slots, but no third party GPU support. We'll see in a few months if that turns out to be true or not.
was looking to upgrade my old 2017 mbpro, so i bought a new 2019 i9 model with 1tb just a few months ago because a reputable computer store was getting rid of their old stock of unopened boxes. combined with an ebay promo, i got it for around 2200 AUD.

just this month i noticed a bunch of refurbished models on the AU apple site, same specs going for over 3000 AUD, so it seems there is still enough demand for them to be charging that much!
Apple doesn't more heavily discount refurbs that don't sell well. They keep the pricing constant for long periods, regardless of how well or poorly they sell. In fact, if there is a lot of availability on the refurb site, it implies lack of demand, or at least oversupply vs. demand. In contrast, stuff like Mac Studios usually sell out immediately on their refurb site.
Last edited: Saturday at 2:39 PM

LEOMODE

macrumors 6502
Jun 14, 2009 Southern California
I think they can upgrade one more next-gen Intel Xeon CPU as well as 7000 MPX series and call it a day. Then maybe AS Mac Pro will be more powerful in both CPU and GPU.

mattspace

macrumors 68020
Jun 5, 2013 2,138 1,705 Australia
I think they can upgrade one more next-gen Intel Xeon CPU as well as 7000 MPX series and call it a day. Then maybe AS Mac Pro will be more powerful in both CPU and GPU.
I'd be curious to know (because I don't know how this works) how much of the motherboard design is inherently PCI 3.0, or if it's more a case of put a different CPU socket in, and change a couple of chips on the board, and the plumbing to the slots is now PCI 4 or 5.

sirio76

macrumors 6502
Mar 28, 2013
It is not crazy, but surely you should not pay full price for it. Buy the base model (even used) and upgrade everything by yourself.

Mac3Duser

macrumors member
Aug 26, 2021
If you can buy a 16 core around 2500 dollars, I think it is ok, but more is a bit too much because the 7.1 has only PCIE 3.0 (when PC are on PCIE 5.0), because AMD RX6000 are now the old gen, because the last intel or AMD CPUs are now by far better than the 2019 xeon... because the Mac studio is better, smaller.

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